For whatever reason, media outlets are going nuts over President Obama’s handshake with Cuban dictator Raul Castro during the funeral of former South Africa President Nelson Mandela.

Report from Fox News:

Cuban-American lawmakers voiced disappointment Tuesday over President Obama shaking the hand of Raul Castro during the memorial service for Nelson Mandela, calling it a “propaganda coup” for the Cuban government.

“It is nauseating,” Rep. Ileana Ros-Lehtinen, R-Fla., who fled Cuba with her family when she was a child, told Fox News.

Speaking later at a hearing with Secretary of State John Kerry, the congresswoman held up photos of the handshake and said political dissidents would be “disheartened” by them.

“Sometimes a handshake is just a handshake, but when the leader of the free world shakes the bloody hand of a ruthless dictator like Raul Castro, it becomes a propaganda coup for the tyrant,” she said.

Sen. Marco Rubio, R-Fla., also released a statement saying: “If the president was going to shake his hand, he should have asked him about those basic freedoms Mandela was associated with that are denied in Cuba.”

Ted Cruz, the only senator in the congressional delegation to Mandela’s memorial, walked out of the service in South Africa when Castro spoke.

So, what to make of this handshake heard ’round the world? Was it simply a cordial meeting between diplomats or a signal that the President is ready to alter relations with Cuba?

52 COMMENTS

  1. I wouldn’t say it was “cordial.” It was just civil. It was two presidents, showing their agreement that Mandela should be honored. Period.

    In his speech, Obama said, “We, too, must act on behalf of justice. We, too, must act on behalf of peace.” Would we then have had him perform a publicity stunt by snubbing one of the other mourners? Not the time or place.

  2. I searched for Castro’s speech, to see why Ted (“Look at me! Look at me!”) Cruz would make a spectacle of himself at a memorial service. I still haven’t found the text, but it’s clear that it was less than ten minutes, and here were the highlights, according to The Guardian:

    Castro calls Mandela “the ultimate symbol of dignity … a prophet of unity, peace and reconciliation”.

    12.39pm GMT

    Mandela led a nation bent on overcoming the consequences of colonialism and racial segregation, Castro says.

    12.43pm GMT

    We shall never forget Mandela’s moving homage to our common struggle, when he visited in 1991 and said the Cuban people have a special place in the hearts of the peoples of Africa, Castro says.

    12.45pm GMT

    Honour and glory for ever to the great comrade Nelson Mandela and the heroic people of South Africa, Castro concludes.

  3. Where do people’s manners go when political fanaticism sets in? It was a handshake because the Cuban leader was placed there by the people who were organizing the event. If President Obma had gone by and snubbed him then it would read “President thinks he’s too good to shake a hand” or something like that. It would have equally looked bad if the President had asked for the Cuban leader to be moved somewhere else.

    Guess what people, this was not our event and it was for something bigger than a handshake. Can the Cuban’s use it for propaganda? Maybe but who cares? The only people who believe it would be the Cubans living in Cuba and they have no say one way or the other so who cares what they’re fed politically?

  4. Unless purposely staged by the U.S. it was politically unavoidable. But i believe a NORMAL POTUS would not have let it happen. Just like a NORMAL POTUS would have never low-bowed or bowed first to a leader from another country – just like we never dip first to any other country.

  5. President Clinton shook hands with Fidel Castro in 2000 after a United Nations luncheon and the same questions were asked. But looking back at least President Clinton had a world view which is something we can’t say about President Obama as witnessed by Obama’s lack of any coherent foreign policy and two inept Secretary of States. The administration seems to jump from one ill-advised foreign policy disaster to the next usually coming out with egg on their face.

    Americas enemies are becoming pushier and with the Presidents recent diplomatic losses in the Middle East and Europe it has undermined Americas credibility. The president is trading away American influence for good will and coming away with neither. We will have to wait to see where this is handshake will lead but this seems to be simply another episode of President Obama diplomacy of soft power toward our enemies while snubbing our friends. In this instance those friends being the Latino-American vote he no longer needs for re-election.

    Where this will lead is open to debate right now. But you have to ask yourself will he appoint NYC’s new Mayor Bill de Blasio ambassador once we resume relations and will President Obama attend Fidel Castro’s funeral when the occasion arises? Well at least he didn’t bow to Raul like he did to Saudi King Abdullah or China’s President Hu Jintao.

    • I love this : “another episode of President Obama diplomacy of soft power toward our enemies”. He killed Bin Laden, he helped topple Col Kadafy, he has killed the most enemies with drones, but he has “soft power toward our enemies”. Is this forum an extension of FOX News or are we here to have an open debate using reality?

      • Carlo’s:

        You want to talk reality why not tell the entire story.

        LMAO…..You make him sound like “Rambo” with his bandolier strapped across his chest. During the Bin Laden raid he stated “I’m not, I can’t. I’m not going to be down there to watch” because he was UPSTAIRS PLAYING 15 GAMES OF SPADES WITH REGGIE LOVE,PETE SOUZA AND MARVIN NICHOLSON. TOPPLE KADAFY? He didn’t know who to support for months before he ok’d air strikes and while we are on Libya what about BENGHAZI? ANOTHER GOAT F’ING WAS HIS RED LINE IN SYRIA. He needed Putin to pull his butt out of that one! Then we have the NSA spying which endeared our allies France, Germany and Great Britain. His whispering diplomacy concerning a missile treaty after the election with Russia, pulling missiles out of NATO partner Poland, leaving Japan to fend for themselves with North Korean missiles and Israel fend for them selves with his sellout with Iran!

        Is that ENOUGH REALITY FOR YOU?

        • Not making him sound like Rambo, just showing you how off your statement was. There are so many mistakes in your comment that I’ll just take a card from the middle of the pack : “…leaving Japan to fend for themselves…”. Put down the remote and pick up a book. If you had studied some history you would know that United States HAS TO defend Japan thanks to the treaty signed with them when they surrendered during the war. I’m not going to try to have a debate with you because you’re just spouting talking points and I can get those by turning on Fox News.

          No more replies from me, I have more important things to do. Have a great day.

          • Yes Carlos – you probably should go to another site. Japan and S. Korea are at the mercy of the immature idiot in N.Korea because he is stupid enough to try something and then we are faced with retaliation and our present POTUS does not guarantee he would retaliate.

            As a matter of fact you should try FNC sometime and learn actual facts instead of MSNBC with B.O.’s cum all over them.

            And any caring American citizen should want Obama impeached and jailed and Clinton convicted and jailed for their failed Benghazi scheme.

            • Sam;

              It’s not only North Korea we need to worry about in the Far East but China is looking to fill the pacific rim leadership void also.

              Every time President Obama has been pushed in foreign policy he backed away. Recognizing this China has every reason to believe we would back off any hostile dispute between Japan and China concerning territorial fishing claims. Or if they really feel ambitious us adhere to our treaty obligations by coming to the aid of Taiwan in the event of an invasion.

              In addition Chinese companies have won up to 90% of the engineering, procurement and construction contracts of Vietnams major projects. China has invested $3.17 billion dollars in 733 projects in Vietnam as of July 2010.

            • Bob – I agree with you about China – I believe they will try to break us financially before resorting to force and China knows they took ‘Nam from us but we won’t let them have Japan, S. Korea, or Taiwan. Maybe the Dufus would try and fudge but Democrats or Pubs wouldn’t let it happen. China is being agressive right now but they have financial and environmental problems of their own. I would not be surprised to see them calls their almost two tetrabuck loans due unless we have a protection clause.

          • Carlo’s;
            So much for the “OPEN DEBATE USING REALITY” you asked for in your 8:41PM post. Your rhetorical bravado seems to be in denial that your ship of state has run aground on the rocks of reality.

            We have lots of treaties which we have obligations to defend but America is war weary and our credibility to abide by those treaties has declined to a point around the world where we have few allies that trust us and few enemies that fear us.

            When you are the leader of the “free world” you don’t lead from behind.

            • Bob:

              That is nonsense.

              For decades, we complained that we were “special” because we ran off half-cocked, refusing to even listen to anyone else–and then complained that we were spending all the money and losing all the lives–because the rest of the world said fine, you have to run the whole show, you can run it alone.

              Bush41 showed how it should be done. Instead of running in there, wildeyed, he got the ENTIRE world on our side, AND ended up with a PROFIT. I thought that would end our efforts to prove our testosterone.

              Libya was THEIR revolution. We couldn’t stop France from messing in it. But we were able to avoid Syria.

    • Bob, good post (with some minor qualifications).

      I would add to your: while “Obama diplomacy of soft power toward our enemies” he has a tough one toward our own citizens (forcing us all to buy his Unaffordable Obamacare, allowing the NSA to continue spying on all Americans and monitor and save all our daily activities for years to come, signing NADA, and many more despicable and constitutionally questionable dictates).

      • obvious;

        Thanks!
        I was thinking of adding to my above post the fact that the current administration also has an obligation to uphold the Constitution but ignores that as well. But this thread concerns foreign policy so I decided not to include it.

  6. Castro through his (as brother in crime to Fidel) actions has the blood of innocent Cubans on his hands; Obama the blood of the dead innocent Americans because of his inaction in Benghazi.

    Just another bloody handshake between two dictators….

    • Oblivious: this is an example of talking out of both sides of your mouth–or, in this case, using two mouths…

      Anyway, you previously posted that you thought we were stupid for punishing tiny Cuba ad infinitum. Yet when you think it suits your hateful purpose, suddenly YOU want to sound like Rambo.

  7. The below from wikipedia is a reminder of why the Cuban government is really an enemy to humanity, and their leader ought not be treated well:

    Human rights in Cuba are under the scrutiny of Human Rights Watch, who accuse the Cuban government of systematic human “rights abuses, including torture, arbitrary imprisonment, unfair trials, and extrajudicial execution.

    Cuban law limits freedom of expression, association, assembly, movement, and the press. Concerns have also been expressed about the operation of due process. According to Human Rights Watch, even though Cuba, officially atheist until 1992, now “permits greater opportunities for religious expression than it did in past years, and has allowed several religious-run humanitarian groups to operate, the government still maintains tight control on religious institutions, affiliated groups, and individual believers.” Censorship in Cuba has also been at the center of complaints.Most emigration is illegal.”

    Things like this are opportunities to remember why guys like Raul are bad guys. He was right beside his brother Fidel for decades. Should Obama have shaken his hand? Only if it was completely unavoidable.

    A leader like him deserves no cordiality. However, if the USA came face to face in a situation like that we would just look petty.

    But then, I don’t think Obama really cares that much about America’s image to the rest of the world. He already thinks we have a terrible one, hence his ‘apology tour’ as it has been called after being elected.

    I would like to know how avoidable the situation was before I made the call on the hand shake.

    • Josh:

      There is a time under heaven for every purpose.

      A memorial service for a great leader that even Elizabeth Warren and Rick Santorum praise is not the time to try to grab media “face time” by snubbing a handshake–or showing off by standing up and walking out when a specially invited dignitary is making a very thoughtful and appropriate nine-minute speech…

      • Goethe…lest we forget, there has always been lots of hand shaking going on. Pictures show Donald Rumsfeld greeting Saddam Hussein with a handshake. John McCain, smiling and handshaking Muammar Gaddafi. President Richard Nixon gave a handshake to Zhou Enlai, China’s Mao, as well as Fidel Castro. President Ronald Reagan handclasping with Ferdinand Marcos. President George W. Bush shaking hands with Hugo Chavez, holding hands and a goodbye kiss for the Saudi prince. It all means exactly nothing. This was just a case of happenstance and simple politeness at a memorial service. Senator Ted Cruz, arose and conspicuously left the service when it was Raul Castro’s turn to speak. As a Congressional Delegate, he knew in advance who would speak so why did he choose to attend? Cruz’s father left Cuba at age 18 before Fidel Castro came to power.

          • Sam: Tess wasn’t being partisan in this case. She was just pointing out that heroes of the people who are now screaming have done the same thing.

            I’m sure we could find lots of examples of Democrats also shaking hands with heinous criminals.

            Instead of standing by principle, we have always acted on “the enemy of my enemy is my friend.”

            It would probably be more helpful to illustrate times when–under circumstances, such as a funeral memorial–our leaders have shaken hands with our enemies, because it was the right thing to do in that venue.

            Certainly, shaking hands at the end of a war does NOT mean that we admire or respect the other person. It just means we AGREE on something, and in this case, all but one of the people at the memorial put their petty politics behind their reverence for the ceremony, for the person being honored, AND for the other people who were there to do likewise.

            • Goethe – actually Tess was being very partisan by listing only Pubs. You are correct ,that through the ages both parties have shook hands with alien ideologies to America..

            • Sam: I did notice that, but figured she was seeing it as an attack on a Democrat from a Republican, so she pulled out the Rumsfeld-Saddam shake and others.

              Tess: As a tactical response, it’s probably more effective to show examples of both parties, so that it is seen as an issue of international diplomacy, and not parochial politics.

              Sam: But back to the point, they’ve been claiming since FDR that presidents say about heinous dicatators who are on our side, “yes, he’s an SOB, but he’s OUR SOB!”

              To tell you the truth, I am more offended by our president forgiving transgressions by our so-called allies–as opposed to trying to find areas of mutual benefit with our so-called enemies.

  8. Obama gets lowest ratings ever — 54% disapproval according to liberal MSM (before his bloody handshake). Wonder what it is now, after it?!

    MSM tries to give an accurate picture of why — reading between their propaganda (polling large cities only), one can logically say that Obama is despised by more than 80% of real Americans (the heartland, the silent majority)!

    If two honest congressmen (not concerned with reelection, but what’s right) are to be found to start Impeachment proceedings NOW that Obama is down, America will sigh in relief with the hope that this usurper of our White House may finally be neutralized!

    http://firstread.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/12/10/21852127-nbcwsj-poll-obama-ends-year-on-low-note?lite

  9. My question here is why does the left feel they have to act like pre-puberty teens at funerals? On a number of occasions this has happened but the selfie picture taken by Danish Prime Minister Helle Thorning-Schmidt, British Prime Minister David Cameron and President Obama was childish and undignified. When will we expect our leaders to exhibit some class and decorum representing us at these solemn events?

    God help us…when will the adults arrive?

  10. That was typical of Obama who is more interested in appeasing every despot on the globe, especially those who share his Marxist and Communist leanings and it is a disgrace to America that he would sink so low in misrepresenting us that way. Some of my dearest friends are Cuban refugees who barely escaped that prison island with nothing but the clothes on their backs as despotic Fidel Castro was taking over half a century ago. Does anyone really think the Floridian and Puerto Rican Cuban communities are not going to justifiably revolt at the notion of now emmbracing what that dictator represents in past suffering to their lives? This is an outrage, period!

  11. Obvious – Obama is not a bloody dictator…well other than his support for letting a child starve to death after surviving an abortion attempt and that the implementation of Obamacare will likely cause the death of people who lose their coverage…like cancer patients covered by a team of doctors under their old plan, but will not get the same doctors under a new plan.

    Obama is very different than Castro though. I would not call him a bloody dictator…he doesn’t have the power to be a bloody dictator. He’s just a terrible president.

    • Josh — “he doesn’t have the power to be a bloody dictator, yet”… *yet* would make this sentence accurate.

      he’s a dictator in his mind, and the transition from his fancy to realization are just a few more of his executive orders away….

  12. Goeth;

    In regard to your 12 December @4:33Pm post.

    You say we did things one way for decades and Bush 41 changed that. Yes we did and the only reason Bush 41 did things different was because of the fall of communist Russia and the mood of the country about getting involved in a war deeper changed.

    The other point I was trying to make that seem to have went over your head was NOT US KEEPING FRANCE FROM “MESSING IN IT” BUT TO KEEP YOUR PRESIDENT FROM MESSING IN IT AS HE WANTED TO.

    • Bob: You diminish Bush41. I believe if he had been in charge earlier in the Cold War, things would have been much different, because he knew how to negotiate–and to listen–and to forge alliance through common interest. He could have just barged in by ourselves, costing many billions and many more lives. Instead, he used his head.

      As for Libya, I think you’re just plain wrong. “Your” president was obviously hoping that outside powers would keep out of the Arab uprisings. You can’t complain that he didn’t do enough against Libya and also say that he was too involved.

      Personally, I think if outside powers had stayed out of places like Libya and Syria, the people there would have been more successful in creating the kind of governments they really wanted.

      • Goethe:

        Circumstances were different for Bush 41 than any other president during the Cold War and therefore we can’t compare apples and oranges. But you are correct I basically don’t think very highly of either Bush.

        As for Libya I never complained he didn’t do enough …….I wanted him to stay out of Libya! What I said was he thought and thought about it before doing anything. In addition he didn’t know who in the rebel faction was going to assume power after the takeover and what their stance toward America was.

        I’m afraid we have to agree that we disagree on your last statement above on the people knowing what type of government they want. Governments in the Middle East have been unstable for decades and it will stay that way for decades.

        • Bob:

          I think you’re not giving Bush41 enough credit. With USSR gone and having no opposition in the world, 41 could have been a “punk” and rushed into Iraq to show off our superiority. Instead,he stepped back and got consensus. Imagine that. As the only superpower, we had an opportunity to cajole the rest of the world to do the right thing. But diplomacy is harder than war.

          I interpreted Libya differently. France seems to have developed delusions of grandeur. They want to get involved all over the world. I think Obama wanted to put the reins on them, but didn’t want to shut them down altogether, since it’s about time for our “allies” to take some initiative. So while I would rather have had us all let Libya find its own way, Obama’s solution was to give France backup.

          And, finally, I agree that it would be decades before those countries could come up with a stable democracy, but I also think we will all be better off if we obey some form of
          “the Prime Directive” of non-interference. . .

          • Goethe:
            Interesting theory on our response to Frances involvement in Libya. Personally from his past foreign policy experiences I think you are showing President Obama to much confidence in this chess match your subscribing to but……

            And finally I couldn’t agree with you more about that non-interference policy.

            • Bob: I think some of the “dithering” charge against Obama is unfair. Sometimes, there are situations when there simply ARE no good responses. So it is best to sit back and see how things shake out, and I’d rather see that than go off half-cocked.

              I did get the impression that Obama was probably pacing in the White House, cursing France for meddling. Syria is another example. We don’t like Assad, but we don’t like al Qaeda and others in the opposition.

              Yes, I realize that Iran and Syria are buddies, but it’s also true that Assad didn’t allow the Sunni group, al Qaeda in, since they cannot be trusted. Syria is 74% Sunni. What do you suppose will happen if Assad falls?

              It’s the same situation we had in Iraq. Saddam was a Sunni who was al Qaeda’s enemy. He was also a balance to Iran. So what did we do? We toppled him, giving Iran an ally and providing an unstable country where al Qaeda can play.

              There are times when doing nothing is better.

    • Bob, and Samreusser, and others with a logical mind — a question for you.

      Do you think Obama, having tasted the intoxication of absolute power that he feels he has, will let go of it come 2016?

      Or do you think he’ll come up with some fake terrorist attack that will give him the excuse to declare Martial Law, and thus suspend all elections accordingly?

      Thereby, making himself our permanent ruler!

      ————————————————————————————-
      Afterall, as a child, Barry Soetero (now known as Barrack Hussein Obama) scribbled on the steps of his elementary school in USA: “King Obama”. Later, as student in Islam lands, he stated to his fellow students that if given a choice to become a businessman or a soldier or politician, he would chose to be the latter — in his young words: “As president I can get businessmen to build me stuff, and soldiers to fight for me”!

      As the young monster Caligula (called “Little Boots” because as a child he liked to dress as a soldier and make the Roman Legions parade in front of him and do his bidding at the age of seven) grew into adulthood, and became Rome’s most despised tyrant — young Obama (with similar delusions of grandeur) came to power in the USA.
      Now, Barry Soetero’s delusions have become Barrack Hussein’s reality.

      The above info has been verified — here is one of the links (see all 3 parts).

      Part 1:

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Og0Mq9Y1PM

      —————————————————————————————

      Don’t know about you — but I’ll bet the farm that unless impeached soon, Barrack Hussein is insane enough to stage another 9/11 to declare himself our ruler past 2016, and then make his kids the next dictators ala North Korea, for decades to come!

      • Obvious – Obama will attempt some ruse to stay in office past 2016! That is almost a given, and i’m guessing he will have to be thrown out of office. One or more of three things must happen for this to not take place –
        1) The congress must be controlled by the Pubs and/or
        2) The Supreme Court must grow some balls and ovaries and think Conservative and/or
        3) The Mainstream Media must turn on him, hence the Low Information Public.
        The Media really has the most control over everything political and affects the direction of government by influencing the general public and Congress.
        I have said this in other Threads on this URL – Obama is not one of us and sincerely desires to take America down. The only POTUS in our history who dislikes THE U.S,A.. This man does not want us or the world to be free. His desire is to turn the U.S. into a Euro-socialist monarchy and be its King.

        • samreusser,

          I’m afraid regardless who wins both houses 2014, Obama has been building his DHS brownshirt army long enough to make his move whenever he feels threatened by any election result, to become dictator via martial law imposed, and implemented by this private army of his.

          Why would the Department of Homeland Security buy nearly One Billion rounds of ammunition (about 3 rounds per US Citizen — or, in other words, their ability to kill every single American (men, women and children combined — totaling 312 million citizens) 3 times over?!

          Why is Obama vetting US Army Generals based on: “Will you fire on Americans at home if the “need” arises?” And the ones saying NO get replaced with his own that say YES?!

          DHS claims for contracting nearly 1,000,000,000 overall (that’s one billion rounds!!!) of ammo, is for practice purposes mostly. However, every single round they are buying is a Hollow Point — the most expensive and devastating bullets that can tear people apart (the reason the Geneva Convention banned such rounds for military use, and only allows FMJ)!

          Full metal jacketed ammo is nearly half the price, and therefore, the one all shooters use to economize the cost when practice shooting. So, if for practice, why hasn’t the DHS bought any FMJ, but only Hollow Points?!

          Rep. Jason Chaffetz (R — Utah) noted that DHS is using more than 1000 rounds per person MORE than the US Army!: “It is entirely inexplicable why the Department of Homeland Security needs so much ammunition”, he said.

          samreusser — you are right, POTUS is up to no good, and dark days are coming soon, unless he gets impeached (but where does one find two honest congressmen risking their political careers to do the right thing…and start impeachment proceeding NOW, before it’s too late?!).

          • if Republicans own Congress they can declare the Martial Law unconstitutional and enough senior Military to follow their oath to take out an illegal POTUS – DHS be damned.

            • Sam:

              In my opinion our current republican leadership in Congress doesn’t have the brass appendage to attempt to enforce that move.

        • Sam…No partisanship intended…but please explain why you say that President Obama “is not one of us”. I take it “us” means the people of the United States. For proof that he has a right to be among us go to the First Judicial Circuit Court State of Hawaii divorce filings on Jan 20, 1964. This decree, between Stanley Ann Dunham Obama and Barrack Obama I, states their son, Barrack Obama II was born Aug 4, 1961 in Honolulu, Hawaii. Ann Dunham returned to the University of Hawaii, with help from her parents, was able to earned her undergraduate degree in four years. In 1967, she married a fellow student, Lolo Soetoro. He was a new hire of Mobil Oil Company and relocated to Indonesia near the city of Jakarta. At 6 years of age, Barrack Obama was enrolled in Santo Fransiskus Asisi, a Roman Catholic school that had been founded jn 1967. In the third grade, the family moved to a different part of the city, Barrack Obama II was transferred to Elementary School Menteng 1. Founded as a Dutch colonial school in 1934, it drew the children of the wealthiest residents in Jakarta and children of employees of American Oil companies operating there. In 1969, Barrack Obama was returned to Honolulu, Hawaii to attend school through high school graduation and lived with his grandparents, the Dunhams. His grandmother, Madelyn Payne Dunham, was vice president of The Bank of Hawaii in Honolulu. Sorta sounds like the people next door to me.

          • Tess: I don’t think Sam is being racist. When he says, he’s not one of “us,” I think he is referring to what he calls “We” the People–a subset of the population with a certain list of beliefs.

            What most people don’t realize is that most people don’t give a crap about our lofty pontifications. Even in Syria, the last I heard, 20% want Assad out, 20% want him to stay, and 60% don’t care who wins, they just want it over.

            Back to Vietnam, it was a stroke of absolute genius for Nixon to say the “Silent Majority” didn’t agree with the protestors,which was true. Of course, nobody had the brains to point out that they didn’t agree with him, either. They just wanted it over.

          • Tess – not getting in a birther disagreement – the only POTUS in our history who dislikes the U.S. and wants us to become a 2nd rate nation and be taken down a notch and is doing everything he can to socialize us. He doesn’t ACT like one of us or the way a POTUS should ACT or PERFORM !!!!

      • obvious: Sorry I took so long to answer but we’ve been away on vacation and then my computer locked.

        I’m not a fan of conspiracy theories so no I don’t think there is a possibility of that happening. In fact I think it’s even dangerous to talk about it. President Obama is at a point where he is just glad to get the scandals and the failure of Obamacare behind him and realizes his support in the party is dwindling. He will fade into history after he leaves office.

  13. “Obvious – Obama will attempt some ruse to stay in office past 2016!…
    if Republicans own Congress they can declare the Martial Law unconstitutional and enough senior Military to follow their oath to take out an illegal POTUS – DHS be damned.”

    WOW! Your irrational paranoia is even worse than I imagined, Sam!
    So should we quick grab our .22’s and attack the White House before the freedom and USA hating Kenyan Muslim can steal people’s right to NOT have health insurance and crowns himself King of the Socialist States of America and starts eating white babies? You teabaggers are a piece of work!

  14. “In my opinion our current republican leadership in Congress doesn’t have the brass appendage to attempt to enforce that move.”

    Incredible! Bob, you and Sam are talking about overturning a national coup by a popular outgoing, two term president, that hasn’t happened, will never happen, and that only the most fearful and paranoid far right-winter would even conceive of happening in their worst nightmare! But here this is accepted as conventional wisdom! And you’re the moderate because you”re “not a fan of conspiracy theories.” and think Obama could actually get away with it! Utterly incrediburgable!

    • Godfrey:

      LMAO…..Whoa slow down here! You’re reading to much into my statement. I’m saying nothing of the sorts.

      This topic has been discussed on the thread entitled “Governor Huckabee Setting Groundwork for 2016 Run” in great length and is to long to repeat here. I therefore suggest you go over there to get a better grasp on my stance. Basically the discussion is between “obvious’ and myself.

      Putting that topic aside what I meant in my post was that I have little to no faith in the establishment wing of the republican party following any principles nor making a stand that would put them in a bad light. They are to concerned with their lifetime tenure as the “Army of Occupation” in Washington.

    • Godfrey: The partisan hysteria just rolls on. I remember a few years ago that a lot of people were saying Bush was going to use the DHS to declare martial law and cancel the 2008 election.

      SSDP

      (“same sh*t, different party)

  15. I was hoping I could find an appropriate thread for this. I think this works–comparing two world leaders, that is. . .

    It’s ironic that today’s headlines include Putin saying he’ll free political foe, Khodorkovsky, and Obama commuting sentences in eight crack cocaine cases. The timing must be embarrassing.

  16. My apologies if I misjudged you, Bob. I’m new here, I don’t have a program, and I don’t have time to read everything people have posted in the past..

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