The 2012 Maine caucuses have left several questions surrounding the integrity and straightforwardness of the caucus process. While it is true that many voting precincts held caucus events around the state between February 4th through the 11th, not every precinct in the state participated in the official results and some precincts were delayed due to inclement weather and will not caucus until this week. Worse still is those precincts that do caucus after the fact will not be included in the official caucus results reported by the Maine Republican Party. Therefore, the official results put out by the Maine Republican Party consist of vote totals from only 84% of caucus precincts.

The Maine Republican Party released this statement for the seeming discrepancy in vote totals which left off at only 84% of precincts reporting yet the official results being delivered with Mitt Romney winning first place:

Maine is considered a ‘beauty contest’ state when it comes to caucuses. That is to say, there are no national delegates ‘won’ or ‘bound’ to any Presidential candidate in our caucus process. At the caucuses, we elect state delegates, election clerks, and in some cases town officers. What we also do is ask those participating in the caucus, to take a poll on which Presidential candidate they prefer. This is an unofficial, non-binding poll, that just simply show’s a ‘snapshot’, or takes the current ‘pulse’, of which Presidential candidate has the most support at the participating caucuses throughout the state. Some caucuses decided to not participate in the Presidential poll, and will caucus after this announcement. Their results WILL NOT be factored into this announcement after the fact. Again, this is an unofficial, non-binding poll, and we will elect our actual national delegation, from the floor of the state convention on May 5TH and 6TH.

Mitt Romney has 39.2 percent of the vote with 2190 votes, Ron Paul has 35.7 percent with 1996 votes, Rick Santorum has 17.7percent with 989 votes, and Newt Gingrich has 6.25 percent with 349 votes.

Note the bold portion (emphasis mine) in that statement indicating that these official results are suspect in that they do not reflect 100% of the caucus voting taking place.

The Ron Paul campaign also took note of this discrepancy and fired off a pointed press release:

“Ron Paul will win the most delegates out of Maine tonight.

“In fact, he will probably even win the ‘beauty contest’ straw poll the media has already called for Mitt Romney – even before all the votes have been tallied.

“In Washington County – where Ron Paul was incredibly strong – the caucus was delayed until next week just so the votes wouldn’t be reported by the national media today.

“Of course, their excuse for the delay was ‘snow.’

“That’s right. A prediction of 3-4 inches – that turned into nothing more than a dusting – was enough for a local GOP official to postpone the caucuses just so the results wouldn’t be reported tonight.

“This is MAINE we’re talking about. The GIRL SCOUTS had an event today in Washington County that wasn’t cancelled!
“And just the votes of Washington County would have been enough to put us over the top.”

While I give no endorsement of any candidate or campaign on this website, I do have to agree with the sentiment put forth by the Paul campaign that if you’re going to call results official, they should reflect 100% of the vote instead of merely 84%. Luckily for Paul, the Maine caucus results are non-binding meaning that they do not directly award delegates toward the 2012 GOP convention. That being said, it does not erase the reporting of a “victory” for the Romney campaign that will often not underscore that the victory resulted from 84% of the vote, not 100%.

My likely unheeded recommendation to the Maine Republican Party: Set your caucus time on 1 night, let all precincts vote, then report 100% of the vote totals and base the official results on those numbers. Mitt Romney may still well have been the victor in Maine, however, at least it would have occurred with 100% of the vote being reported.

86 COMMENTS

  1. Even if you accept the “official” tally, Romney received a significantly lower percentage of the vote than he received in his LOSING campaign in 2008. In primary after primary this year, Romney is doing worse than he did when he lost the nomination last time.

    • Goethe Behr —

      I’ll postulate the following as a premise:

      The reason the Maine GOP rushed to announce the partial results as “A Win For Romney” was their fear that if the rest were counted, Mitt will become a 4-time loser!

      From this premise I’ll make the following conclusion:

      The GOP (now, that Newt’s low ratings have made him a persona non grata) has banked their hopes on Mitt to win against Bama (they figure that a three-face liar can win against a two-face liar…three being more than two….).

  2. How many times does one have to say “unofficial and non-binding” before people take the hint that this is unofficial and non-binding. It’s really disgusting to see presidential candidates, people associated with presidential elections, and the base support of presidential candidates unable to read and comprehend such plain language. Twice he said “unofficial and unbinding” combined with clearly stating how the actual delegates will be chosen combined with clearly stating this was a “poll” not a delegate count. There was absolutely no effort on Maine’s part or Romney’s part to misrepresent this unofficial, non-binding poll.

    Take some remedial reading lessons, please.

    • Marlene,

      There was absolutely no effort on Maine’s part or Romney’s part to misrepresent this unofficial, non-binding poll.

      I think that’s true, however, you can’t erase the overall appearance of a disorganized caucus system in Maine when “official” results consist of 84% of the vote and many caucus attendees will not have their vote count toward even the beauty contest. I am not alleging wrongdoing but I am alleging that what they did sure opens the door for the allegations to fly and arguments to make changes in the Maine caucus system moving forward. That all being said, I don’t live in Maine and have not directly experienced their caucuses so I am saying this purely as someone with no firsthand experience in their process.

      • Nate —

        Attention: TO THE FOUNDER OF THIS SITE — will you please, stop posting the “2012 Delegate Tracker” in the top left corner as a real count!

        The posting as of now;

        Romney 123
        Santorum 72
        Gingrich 32
        Paul 19
        (Huntsman) 2

        Is not a TRUE count, but a SPECULATION. As such, it creates an illusion that these are DEFINITE Delegates won — and undermines the people’s belief that their trailing candidate has a chance, (thereby, possibly making them give up)!

        If you need to post this “count” — please, preface it as:

        “SPECULATIVE 2012 Delegate Tracker — Not FACTUAL, but perceived”

        Thank you!

      • Nate —

        ILLEGAL EVERYTHING — Must-Watch special aired on FOX! See it below:

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?&v=CFfVeXhtRa0

        It is estimated that nearly 500,000,000 as of 2010 (and each year EVEN MORE are passed) — about 1/2 billion — NEGATIVE Laws/rules/regulations are on the books, meaning: “You, the US Citizen, cannot do 1/2 billion things, because we, the Government, have deemed such actions ILLEGAL.”

        More Negative Laws than the total count of US Citizens (including babies, children, and adults in our Nation)!

        The Arrogance of Office is best displayed by this pernicious Sophism: “Ignorance of the Law is no excuse”.

        No sane person can expect an individual to memorize all the names of the 312 million US Citizens — but same individual is expected to know the EXACTITUDE of ALL 1/2 billion LAWS (or be penalized for the IGNORANCE)?!

        The Great Roman Statesman Cicero stated: ‘The MORE Laws in a Nation, the LESS Justice for the Citizens’ — nearly 2000 years later, Cicero’s warning rings true: *More Laws = Less Liberty*!

        I’ve been saying it for decades, to no avail — now FOX comes to the rescue (hope you can disseminate it through “tweeter”, “facebook” and other internet means you young people are aware)!
        Thank you.

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?&v=CFfVeXhtRa0

    • Marlene —

      Did the February 11th Headlines on TV stations across the US read: ‘Mitt Romney wins Maine’ (yes or no)?

      Come on…you can say it, it’s not that hard — we all know the answer.

      Some may need remedial reading lessons, but you are in definite need of Logic 101 (if you are to rise in the political ranks of Mitt Romney’s camp). Hope the below helps you:

      That particular GOP rep announced FIRSTLY that Mitt WON (39% to Ron Paul’s 36%)! As such his statement became TRUTH for that moment!

      Then cameras flashed, people yelling “Go Mitt” were heard, applauding ensued for a time! Afterward, he QUALIFIED his statement that NOT ALL counts have been made as of the time of this ANNOUNCEMENT — a TRUTH cannot have ANY QUALIFIERS (since they negate its VALIDITY)!

      As reprehensible as his MISSTATEMENT was — the main stream media’s behavior was even more reprehensible! Instead of jumping on this — and exposing it as SPECULATION, not true result — the media proclaimed Mitt as winner, and within minutes blanketed America with this “result”!

    • I think you’re missing the point: Whether the vote was binding or not, it has been widely reported as a win for Romney. Now, if he didn’t win the straw poll, justice at least would argue that the facts be revealed. There is also the issue that it being proclaimed as win has allowed one candidate to capitalize (pun intended) on the news at the possible expense of another candidate. Again, whether the straw poll is binding or not, it was immediately reported by all the major news outlets as a “win”.

      There is another aspect to this, however. That the state party seems to have played a bit fast and loose with the rules undermines the process. Further, their digging in their heals on not allowing the remaining precints to be counted erodes confidence in the transparency and honesty of their management of the process – particularly if it’s not a binding vote. What have they got to lose?

    • Marlene. You sound as though you might be a Mainiac. I’m sure Maine’s caucus rules were invented long before the advent of instant global communication. Those rules need to be brought into the 21st century, they need to be updated, tightened up to prevent any future partisan skulduggery. It is not helping anyone for Maine’s caucus leaders to have the freedom to manipulate the process to present the appearance that a particular candidate has “won” the state when in fact that candidate may never get a single delegate vote from Maine. In case you hadn’t noticed, momentum in political campaigns is critical in this era of rapidly shifting polls and instantaneous tweeting. If the results of Maine’s caucus are as non-binding as all that, perhaps Maine shouldn’t even report winners or losers at all. In any case you’ll just have to forgive us if we don’t take the Mainiac caucus seriously for the time being. There’s no question that non-Romney candidates have good reason to be dubious of the integrity of the process there.

      • Yippee K — all Maine had to do is state the results were too close to call (and won’t be announced until a final count has been completed).

        Instead, the triple chinned GOPist took the podium and said: “…And the winner is…*dramatic pause*…Mitt Romney”! (And the media spread this news across the nation).

        Now, that the dust is settling, if not perfidy, at least chicanery, should be leveled at those responsible for this outrage of misinformation!

  3. Marlene: What article did you read? This article had nothing at all to do with “unofficial and non-binding.” The article was stating that the caucus was a mess–with votes not counted, voters turned away, others told to vote after their vote would matter. Even if it’s just a beauty contest, it should have SOME sense of integrity.

    Maine did a worse job than Iowa–in which Romney was crowned, Santorum was crowned, then they had to admit that they had no idea what they were doing. In Maine’s case, it’s clear that Ron Paul would have won the “unofficial and non-binding” waste-of-time contest if any semblance of professionalism and honesty were evident.

  4. CharlieKingMaker —

    The good news is that this fiasco has gotten incredible attention on the net. Groups such as watchthevote2012.com are already challenging with sworn affidavits ready to file.

    The end result should be (a prediction, not a conclusion) that the GOP will be discredited, and Romney will suffer most, once exposed as their fair-haired child.

  5. Attention: TO THE FOUNDER OF THIS SITE — will you please, stop posting the “2012 Delegate Tracker” in the top left corner as a real count!

    The posting as of now;

    Romney 123
    Santorum 72
    Gingrich 32
    Paul 19
    (Huntsman) 2

    Is not a TRUE count, but a SPECULATION. As such, it creates an illusion that these are DEFINITE Delegates won — and undermines the people’s belief that their trailing candidate has a chance, (thereby, possibly making them give up)!

    If you need to post this “count” — please, preface it as:

    “SPECULATIVE 2012 Delegate Tracker — Not FACTUAL, but perceived”

    Thank you!

    • Can you give me the number of delegates that are bound to certain candidates, or give me a reliable site where i can find this? thanks a lot!

      • Friend from Canada — a Crystal Ball only (and I’m not being facetious).

        Ask ‘Goethe Behr’ — who’ll be able to give you a detailed and accurate explanation on the process.

        Here is my simplification:

        1) Some States — like Florida — are ‘bound’ to give all their delegates to the winner (meaning 99.9% for sure ALL are in the bag for winner Mitt).

        2) Other States are ‘bound’ to give proportional delegates according to placement percentage (meaning that ‘most likely’ the delegates will be proportioned accordingly to who won how much).

        3) Caucus States — the winner ‘should’ get the majority of votes, but may possibly not win any at all. The caucusing continues after the votes are in, until a ‘determination’ as to the meritoriousness of candidate/s (not the single one deemed the “best” or the “second best” by the perceived count) is reached. After this is done, delegates ‘commit’ their vote to the one/s they determined as best.

        4) At the Convention — changing of delegates may be done due to internal GOP pressure, switching by external Public displeasure, etc., deals struck, etc., etc., etc……..

        Very crude, and probably inaccurate, answer to your question — Reliable counter on Delegates Won? — just trying to let you know that one can ONLY speculate at this time (and nothing more)!

  6. I don´t understand what a problem is there. Ron Paul is the best candidate, he is the most honest candidate, he has optimal solution for USA , he does not intend to destroy the rest of the world. He is normal man.
    What do you want to do? Do you want to have Romney, Santorum or Gingrich, naturally that these donkeys can win contest for comedy central or something alike but they have no chance in general elections, because everybody will vote for the least evil ( B. Obama ).
    But you can vote normal, honest republican candidate, the only caniddate, who can be offered as republican presidential candidate- Ron Paul and he has really chances with Obama, because he is normal, he has programm, his foreign politics is very good, he does not make social cuts, he does not repeal Obama health care ( what will be done immedietely by Romney, Gingrich or Santorum )maybe he will improve it by for instance taking away for instance contraception for everybody. He will decrease taxes for middle class, he will not support global speculators and global military lobbysts, he will back take US troops homes, he will stop to unleash mindless wars. He will end wars led by your country. He will make proper spending, where it is needed. He will be really good, strong, wise president, if you give chance for him.

    • It is possible that Paul is not getting enough votes because many people don’t like his ideas. Even I a staunch conservative would have difficult time deciding whether to vote for Paul or Obama (most likely neither).

      • Paul is doing great even though Obama said, “give him zero coverage”

        http://www.abulsme.com/2012/02/12/2012-republican-delegate-count-maine-and-a-paul-super/
        For this site, we use estimates from The Green Papers for delegates. These assume that the eventual delegate allocation will be proportional to the straw poll results, at least at first approximation. When later rounds of the delegate selection process happen, the numbers will get revised and may be quite different. As an example, the Ron Paul campaign is saying that they think in the end they will actually get the most delegates from Iowa, Minnesota and Colorado because they had their people stay around after the straw polls and actually run to be delegates to the later stages while the other campaigns for the most part ignored this. We shall see how that plays out. In the mean time, while one can look at only completely determined delegates like DCW does in their primary count, but we’ll use the projected eventual delegates from caucus states until better numbers are available later in the process…

        Anyway, now on to the main event. Since the last update, we had the preliminary Maine results (estimated as described above), and Ron Paul gained one superdelegate. So for the day, Paul gains 9 delegates, Romney 8, Santorum 4 and Gingrich 1. So Paul wins the day, right? Or maybe like most people saying, it is a win for Romney since he got the most actual votes in the straw poll?

        Wrong. The right answer is that after today EVERYBODY is further away from the nomination than they were yesterday. (Paul just lost the least ground.) Nobody got a high enough percentage of the delegates from today to be on track for getting to 1144 delegates before the convention. The delegate take is continuing to be split in such a way that nobody is taking a majority of the delegates.

        In fact, with these results, Romney slips below 50% of the delegates allocated so far for the first time since his big delegate win from the winner take all contest in Florida. Prior to today, if he just continued getting delegates at the same percentage he had been so far, he would win the nomination. Since he is now below 50% again, that means he has to actually improve his performance above his historical levels (slightly) to get to 1144.

        • Don J, that is such non-sense. Obama would love to have Paul get more coverage, because Paul makes the other candidates look ridiculous.

          If anyone has the pull and motive to shut down Paul’s coverage, it’s the Romney-Industrial Complex. . .

          The funny thing is that Romney’s getting less support than he did last time, state after state. He’s gonna be the Harold Stassen of the 21st Century.

          • Goethe Behr —

            Disagree — Bama’s worst nightmare would be debating Ron Paul (without a tele-prompter Bama can hardly put two coherent statements together, let alone an unscripted hour+ debate)!

            Ron Paul’s Constitutional knowledge, accurate historical data, superior by ten fold intellect, and good nature as a genuine caring person — even though not an orator (RP) — will by SUBSTANCE destroy the small-minded narcissistic Bama’s empty Rhetoric and the Bankrupt Socialist Dogma he spews in ANGER when “displeased”!

            Bama had some worries in debating Newt (the two can out-lie each other, on any given occasion). But now that Newt is nearly done — Bama is happy.

            Bama is on top of the world NOW — since his reelection is about to be GUARANTEED by the GOP’s choice to do whatever it takes (legal or illegal) for tepid Mitt to challenge him (Romney-Money is what the out-of-touch GOP hopes may counter Bama’s billion dollars campaign)!

            This will be the best outcome for Bama — to face flip-flopping Romney (since Bama can make Mitt turn any way he wants…after all Mitt stands for everything (and nothing)…depending on the audience)! Bama’s writers have already scripted what Bama needs to remember, so he can rip Mitt apart on Bain Capital and Cayman Islands accounts!

            Prediction: Bama wins by virtue of GOP’s idiocy!

          • i agree with surfisher… obama cant debate worth anything… its too bad that herman cain is out of this race because of false accusations… he could nail obama in any debate, and become the next president easier than any of the other candidates.

    • First let me say that I am a Ron Paul fan and will vote for him. However i am starting to hope that the Reflubs will continue with there circus and RP dosen’t win there rigged BS primary. As long as he stays the course, he (or who he endorses) will have the first real chance to end the 2 party clown act.
      People want a REAL CHANGE! WE ARE STILL LOOKING!
      IF NOT US, WHO! IF NOT NOW, WHEN!

    • he is the most honest candidate,

      might want to change the word “most” to the word “only”………..

  7. DonJ —

    Informative post.

    To condense it — Mitt needs to spend his total Money wad of hundreds of millions of dollars in ads now, just to stay afloat (in the far hope of getting close to 1144). Newt and Rick have become impotent — but are needed to take away votes from Mitt.

    Ron Paul benefits from this.

    Great news for those believing in Liberty and Prosperity for Americans — the Ron Paul supporters!

  8. It is all about presentation.
    Gingrich and Romney know how to smooth talk.
    Paul and Santorum are not so smooth talkers.

    People should look up the issues, history, and voting records more than the funny 1 liners.

    Votes 2011 2008 % #
    Maine Obama 1,795 2,063 -13 -268
    Paul 1,996 1,011 97 985
    Romney 2,190 2,844 -23 -654

    It seems Romney is doing worse than Obama in % drop. Main is not the only one. Full chat will be on the link.
    http://trenchpress.com/?page_id=7456

  9. It’s not that his ideas are not popular. We all grew up being fed the same ideas. Somewhere along the line you are disappointed once, and then again, and again and it goes on until you get used to it, and after awhile it becomes usual, and you think they are all the same. It’s almost like women in domestic violence situations who are afraid of leaving. Or underpaid workers who know they are abused but still are afraid to leave. Many people get used to being abused, and later will abuse others, after some time you can’t tell where is the line. Words also start meaning different things. And many get used to the contradictions
    Most people cannot tell anymore, when they are being screwed. Where are the limits of government? Even fewer people remember or know what’s in the Declaration of Independence, the Bill of Rights, or the Constitution and the very few ones who do are not willing to fight for these rights. If they would, the Libertarian party would be a strong 3rd force and Dr. Paul would be there instead of in a corner of the Republican Party.

  10. I just wan to know where big mouth Marlene owebamas number one succubus went. Good job guys of shutting her up only I wouldn’t have been so nice.

  11. I don’t know if it’s all the fluoride water that people here in America are drinking that makes everybody just sit there and do nothing, when everybody knows the fraud is obvious. The evidence is right there but the fraudsters keep lying and making excuses.
    If there was suspected election fraud in some third world country, u better believe the people there, rise up and make sure their government doesn’t try and skrew them again.

  12. It means what? That there is fraud by these elections. Clearly, everybody wants to have normal president and I think that majority of people know that the only proper and normal candidate is Ron Paul.

    • As they say, Democrats “fall in love,” and Republicans “fall in line.” Almost always, the runner up in one election will be the nominee the next time. It’s a country club atmosphere. Look at 2004. Dole is a nice person, but he was a horrible candidate. But the party felt he “deserved” the nomination, as a handicapped war vet and having worked for the party for so long. Likewise, McCain got the nomination last time, even though he was not liked inside the party. He had just paid his dues.

      THAT is what this is about. Romney has flown a lot of miles, shaken a lot of hands, so the party leadership figures he has “earned” the nomination. It’s a prize.

      The party faithful also “fall in line.” At this point, they’re buying the idea that Romney “could win.” That’s the ONLY thing people seem to say in his favor. So people vote for him now so they can vote for him in November. It’s not about whom they want or even whom they like. It’s just desperation, looking for the candidate they figure they can “sell” to independents.

  13. What do you see in this Romney? Because it is hardly to understand. This man is backed by all speculators ( it means that he will finance their pockets from your taxes and he will draw USA in more debts, USA has presently 13 or 14 trilions – it means poverty)he is backed by pro-war mongers, it means that he will involve USA in more wars and in perspective in global world war, which will ruin and destroy your country.
    he is no American – offspring of illegal Jew, he is not Mexican, he is not similiar to Mexicans, he is even no Christian ( it is some kind of sectarian ). He has no programm, his programm relies upon critics of all contrcandidates, he moves like fly in fat soup. Why is he popular?
    You have Ron Paul, good, honest, normal candidate, who has reasonable programm, who is American, who is honest, who is Christian. What is going on with USA? The last time and the last possibility to have normal president.

  14. The issue is not VOTER FRAUD. Any one who thinks that the head of the GOP would so stupidly resort to fraud must be naive.
    They created a deceptive, manipulating system, that allows them to get their intended result.
    The Maine GOP page http://www.mainegop.com/2012/01/maine-g-o-p-2012-caucus-information/, very clearly shows how the caucus works. Counties and Districts have different dates and times according to the there convenience. Wherever the polls had a advantage to the intended results go first on the 11th, so they can make the big announcement. The more challenging Districts or areas, who support other candidates, do not get to vote until the 18th or get rescheduled, moved ,etc. Making the support for other candidates loose steam and momentum.
    The only point is that it is used to discourage ones and create momentum for the chosen one by them.
    The media and pollsters help discourage some and create momentum for others. It’s not Fraud. Deceptive? yes. Manipulative? yes Dishonest? yes Unfair? yes But not fraud.
    It’s hardball on steroids. This is how the game is played.

    • If you actually read the rules it says: “All caucuses must be held by March 20, 2012”. Some don’t vote until march 3rd. The official results might be announced much later or not at all. To be a delegate you must be willing to PAY a considerable amount of money and expenses as well, or have a rich sponsor.

    • Steve L —

      re: “The issue is not VOTER FRAUD. Any one who thinks that the head of the GOP would so stupidly resort to fraud must be naive…..”

      Agree — but for propaganda purposes (such as the propaganda: “Romney wins Maine!”), “VOTER FRAUD” hits a nerve (as such it’s MUCH MORE EFFECTIVE than “voter manipulation, exclusion, some no-counts, etc.”)!

      As you say: “it is hardball” — so why pull punches that score?!

      • that the head of the GOP would so stupidly resort to fraud must be naive…..”

        The question isn’t “would he” , it is “did he”………….

    • Surfisher

      Scroll to the top of the page and on the left-side column you will find; Contact us and the link to email the editor (Nate).

      • Windisea —

        I tried it (states: Email Subscription Request …FeedBurner; after subscribing, still cannot send an e-mail).

        Just hope someone will send them this e-mail (for perusal, and decision on merit):

        “Attention: TO THE FOUNDER OF THIS SITE — will you please, stop posting the “2012 Delegate Tracker” in the top left corner as a real count!

        The posting as of now;

        Romney 123
        Santorum 72
        Gingrich 32
        Paul 19
        (Huntsman)2

        Is not a TRUE count, but a SPECULATION. As such, it creates an illusion that these are DEFINITE Delegates won — and undermines the people’s belief that their trailing candidate has a chance, (thereby, possibly making them give up)!

        If you need to post this “count” — please, preface it as:

        “SPECULATIVE 2012 Delegate Tracker — Not FACTUAL, but perceived”

        Thank you!”

      • Surfisher

        Try your ‘other’ left lol. It looks like the example below and only requires you to enter a “captcha code”.

        Contact Us

        Email the Editor
        About the site

  15. Slightly off topic but I just wanted to say thanks for keeping this up to date. I’d lost track of what was going on in the elections the last month or two and this blog has been great to get me right back on track – thanks a lot! Keep up the good work.

  16. Bama’s worst nightmare would be debating Ron Paul (without a tele-prompter Bama can hardly put two coherent statements together, let alone an unscripted hour+ debate)!

    Ron Paul’s Constitutional knowledge, accurate historical data, superior by ten fold intellect, and good nature as a genuine caring person — even though not an orator (RP) — will by SUBSTANCE destroy the small-minded narcissistic Bama’s empty Rhetoric and the Bankrupt Socialist Dogma he spews in ANGER when “displeased”!

    Bama had some worries in debating Newt (the two can out-lie each other, on any given occasion). But now that Newt is nearly done — Bama is happy.

    Bama is on top of the world NOW — since his reelection is about to be GUARANTEED by the GOP’s choice to do whatever it takes (legal or illegal) for tepid Mitt to challenge him (Romney-Money is what the out-of-touch GOP hopes may counter Bama’s billion dollars campaign)!

    This will be the best outcome for Bama — to face flip-flopping Romney (since Bama can make Mitt turn any way he wants…after all Mitt stands for everything (and nothing)…depending on the audience)! Bama’s writers have already scripted what Bama needs to remember, so he can rip Mitt apart on Bain Capital and Cayman Islands accounts!

    Prediction: Bama wins by virtue of GOP’s idiocy!

    • Sounds good but Paul doesn’t have much to say that the voters want to hear. It’s the pork, pork, we want pork and I’m the guy that can hand it out that bring out the votes.

      Don’t believe me?……….just read the history book…….And today it’s Obama vs the Prince of Pork (aka Santorum)

  17. Surfisher–Again, non-sense.

    Obama would LOVE to have Ron Paul get media attention NOW. Why? Because he can’t win INSIDE the Republican Party. All he can do is make the others look like idiots.

    I’ve been watching political campaigns since 1956, and I can tell ya–nobody gets the Republican Nomination by accident. The ONLY true conservative to win the GOP nomination in my memory was Barry Goldwater, and you know why? Because shortly after the assassination of JFK, if they had reincarnated Abraham Lincoln, he couldn’t have won. Reagan wasn’t a true conservative. If you’d look at his real record, you’d go nuts. I don’t know what the recent Bush was. Does anybody?

    So, my point is, Paul is NOT going to win INSIDE the GOP. It just will not happen. So Obama would LOVE to have him in there, gutting the other GOP candidates.

    I’M NOT SAYING PAUL SHOULDN’T WIN. I’m just saying that the “super delegates” wouldn’t allow it. And if they did, the hokey, ramshackle coalition the GOP built up is NOT going to elect a guy who wants to stop war and legalize pot. What Ike called the “Military Industrial Complex” wouldn’t allow cutting into their pork barrel–which is the real power of the Republican Party. And the far-right religious, who have been cobbled into the mix, wouldn’t go for Paul’s sanity, either.

    Ron Paul would probably be a great president, but I don’t believe he’s in it to win, anyway. He’s just trying to force the other GOP candidates to talk his way, walk his way, talk his way, walk his way. . . .

    And, yeah, Obama would love to face Romney, because Romney is a symbol of the out-of-touch uber-rich that really run the GOP, and if he played his cards right (he won’t), he could reassemble a large part of the coalition that FDR built in the 30s.

    • Goethe Behr —

      The premise for my post was: Obama’s worst debating fear is if Ron Paul wins the nomination (sorry if I did not state that more clearly).

      • Surfisher: No, your premise was that the REASON Ron Paul is not getting press is that Obama won’t allow it.

        The fact is, Obama would LOVE to have Ron Paul get more press, because the real power of the Republican Party is very rich and powerful capitalists (like Romney). In order for that small number of people to win elections, they have used the media to create issues that will appeal to entirely different people. They don’t want small government, because big government is what hands out big contracts to the big money people.

        That’s why the GOP would NEVER allow Ron Paul to be a serious contender. They would spend millions to brainwash people to vote against him. If that didn’t work, they’d play games, as they did in Iowa and Maine to rig the vote.

        Obama would love to keep Ron Paul in the race as long as possible, because he is making the rest of the field look idotic. Now, on the other hand, if Paul got the nomination, Obama would be in big trouble, because Paul appeals to the same, youthful, change-oriented voters who put Obama into office in the first place.

        Obama wants Ron Paul in the race–because the GOP will NOT allow Paul to win.

        • Goethe Behr —

          Agree with all you state in this post (except: “No, your premise was that the REASON Ron Paul is not getting press is that Obama won’t allow it”; I’ve never said this, but: “Bama’s worst nightmare would be debating Ron Paul (without a tele-prompter Bama can hardly put two coherent statements together, let alone an unscripted hour+ debate)!”…meaning one-on-one Presidential debates).

          For months I’ve been saying that there is a black-out imposed by the media on Ron Paul — since the GOP fears that if Ron Paul’s message is heard by all, Romney and Newt will have no chance to be elected (never once implicated Bama in this…since he’s too busy rubbing his hands in glee, preparing to ‘slaughter’ the Chosen Lamb: Mitt).

          • Surfisher: We agree, then. Except that, again, you did say that Obama is stifling Ron Paul, which is the opposite of what he wants. Ron Paul is trying to upset the trough that both parties feed from.

            I also agree that Obama is not a good speaker. The people who say he is a great speaker are racists who expect him to speak Ebonics.

            Newt or Ron would wipe up the floor with Obama in a debate. Santorum comes off as Mr. Potato Head, and Romeny is just too sleazy. If Romney didn’t start with millions of dollars, he’d be a slick used car salesman on the north side of Detroit right now. Against Obama, he will look like just another fast-talking, rich, powerful, older white guy who got us into our messes. (I’m an older white guy, by the way.)

          • Goethe Behr — I value your posts, since they are spot on!

            But, I never stated Bama is stifling Ron Paul — it is a ‘DonJ’ post (not mine) you are referring to (and I stated “informative post DonJ”).

            I’ll state the following: You are 100% correct (I failed wording my slight disagreement properly, so the fault is mine)!

          • Bama can hardly put two coherent statements together, let alone an unscripted hour+ debate)!”…meaning one-on-one Presidential debates).

            Try selling that to Hillary.

        • They would spend millions to brainwash people to vote against him.

          You really think they would have too. I mean what Prez has won by the biggest margin ever?

          Right, Nixon (the bigger the crook, the better they like him)

  18. People. Please!!! Don’t play head games with Ron Paul. He’s liable to run off and endorse the Communist Party if he isn’t treated more fairly than everyone else.

    • He’s liable to run off and endorse the Communist Party if he isn’t treated more fairly than everyone else.

      Bet you or your parents voted for Nixon back in ’72.

  19. Stalin said that it does not matter what the vote count is only who counts the votes!!! The handling of the Maine election is an insult to everything the United States stands for. It is an insult to the marrow of my soul.

    • The handling of the Maine election is an insult to everything the United States stands for.

      Yeah but don’t think Mines has a monopoly on it.

    • Michael Murphy — good post!

      And Hitler said: “A lie repeated a thousand times becomes ‘truth’!”.

      Qvo Vadis America…?

      • More on education, tough on crime, a stronger national defense, less government, a balanced budget, and lower taxes for all.

  20. With a race as close as this it is very obvious that the results could change drasticly, and i strongly agree with Ron Paul’s campaign statement. The US needs a strong governmment, and Romney cant provide that,but if he gets in with 100% of the polls reporting, so be it. I think that Maine should be penalized for this, with the removal of some of their delegates, as was seen for the states who held their elections earlier than what was permitted.

    • The US needs a strong governmment, and Romney cant provide it

      What it needs and what it is going to get are two different things..

      I say we are going to get more of the same:

      Higher taxes

      More regulations

      Bigger debt

      Always was, is and shall be so long as we have elections.

  21. NEVER forget the litmus test a Government has to pass: “A Government that does not trust its Citizens to own guns, is a Government not to be trusted!” Lack of such trust will turn the Citizens into SUBJECTS!

    And that’s what Bama is getting ready to do! Read below:

    *** NRA official: Obama wants to outlaw guns in 2nd term ***
    A top official with the National Rifle Association said Friday that President Obama will move to “destroy” gun rights and “erase” the Second Amendment if he is re-elected in November.
    While delivering one of the liveliest and best-received speeches at the Conservative Political Action Conference in Washington, NRA Executive Vice President Wayne LaPierre said the president’s low-key approach to gun rights during his first term was “a “conspiracy to ensure re-election by lulling gun owners to sleep.”
    “All that first term, lip service to gun owners is just part of a massive Obama conspiracy to deceive voters and hide his true intentions to destroy the Second Amendment during his second term,” he said.
    “We see the president’s strategy crystal clear: Get re-elected and, with no more elections to worry about, get busy dismantling and destroying our firearms’ freedom, erase the Second Amendment from the Bill of Rights and excise it from the U.S. Constitution.”
    Mr. LaPierre said the president’s two Supreme Court appointees — Sonia Sotomayor and Elena Kagan— are “two of the most rabid anti-gun justices in history.” He also accused Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg of being a foe of gun rights.
    And with the possibility of two or more Supreme Court justice positions opening during the next four years, the NRA official warned that gun ownership would be in jeopardy if Mr. Obama stays in office.
    “If we get one more like those three, the Second Amendment is finished,” he said. “It’ll be the end of our freedom forever.”
    Mr. LaPierre, who said “there is no greater freedom than to own a firearm,” predicted that gun owners will rally en masse to defeat Mr. Obama in November.
    “All of what we know is good and right about America, all of it could be lost if Barrack Obama is re-elected,” he said. “It’s all or nothing.”

      • In the years prior to the Revolutionary War, the British, in response to the colonists’ unhappiness over increasingly direct control and taxation of the colonies, imposed a powder embargo on the colonies in an attempt to lessen the ability of the colonists to resist British encroachments into what the colonies regarded as local matters. Two direct attempts to disarm the colonial militias fanned what had been a smoldering resentment of British interference into the fires of war. These two incidents were the attempt to confiscate the cannon of the Concord and Lexington militias, leading to the Battles of Lexington and Concord of April 19, 1775, and the attempt, on April 20, to confiscation militia powder stores in the armory of Williamsburg, Virginia, which led to the Gunpowder Incident and a face off between Patrick Henry and hundreds of militia members on one side and the Royal Governor of Virginia, Lord Dunmore, and British seamen on the other. The Gunpowder Incident was eventually settled by paying the colonists for the powder.[26]

    • Surfisher
      Great post, thanks for sharing it. We must be vigilant in protecting our civil rights!

      This seems like a good time to remind everyone here about the Hillsdale College FREE 10-week online Constitution Course which begins February 20th. Study materials, quizzes and they even issue a certificate after completion!
      Generous sponsorship is provided by Mr. R. Steve Corbett – Nashville TN

      Each lecture is pre-recorded and lasts approximately 40 minutes. Lectures and other study materials will be released by noon each Monday according to the schedule. Once released, they are available to view at your convenience.

      Constitution 101: The Meaning and History of the U.S. Constitution – Hillsdale College
      constitution.hillsdale.edu

      About Hillsdale

      Founded in 1844, Hillsdale College located in rural southern Michigan is an independent, coeducational, residential, liberal arts college with a student body of about 1,400. Its four-year curriculum leads to the bachelor of arts or bachelor of science degree, and it is accredited by the North Central Association of Colleges and Secondary Schools.

      Hillsdale’s educational mission rests upon two principles: academic excellence and institutional independence. The College does not accept federal or state taxpayer subsidies for any of its operations.

      I’m excited about taking this course and hope many of you are able take advantage of this unique opportunity too!

      Windisea

  22. It gets about elections and it gets about voting for the best candidate among all present candidates and the best candidates, who has the best intentions, who is honest and who has many other good features is Ron Paul and he should win. Where is and what is the problem? He should win and repair all this mess, which was done. Debts, global wars, chaos everywhere nd again more wars and more debts. People must begin to think. Ron Paul is the only opportunity for real, good and positiv changes and this chance cannot be lost. When not now, then where? Never.

    • Where is and what is the problem?

      His age, the way he delivers the message, he is a dove in a world of hawks, the people want pork, he is against the patriot act, the older generation vote the younger generation tend not to. (liberty for security).

      • I don’t disagree with Ron Paul’s theory about what ought to be done next but I don’t think the real opportunity here is to elect him president. That won’t happen. The real opportunity is to have him around and have his theories influencing the policy of the ruling coalition. That is entirely possible and Ron Paul supporters should accept that at this stage, this is what needs to happen. It might be different if his ideas had already been implemented at some point and were proven to a sufficient degree to convince those who can’t understand them just hearing about them. Billy Malone, you seem to think Ron Paul is against pork. Unfortunately that’s one of the major problems with Ron Paul. He’s the king of pork. All he’s done for the last thirty years is deliver pork to his district. He’s had his head in the sand, some prophet in the wilderness, throwing his vote away and taking pork back home just to keep his seat. If he’d actually really been in the fray, bartering his vote in exchange for other votes on a few important measures here and there, working with like-minded folks and fighting a smart political fight for what he believes in like Gingrich did so well for ten terms or like Santorum or anyone else who has actually fought for conservative ideas, you’d all be calling him a neocon and a liberal now and whatever other completely inaccurate things you’ve had to say about these other guys.

        • The Matagorda Ship Channel stretchs 25 miles from the Gulf to public and private
          terminal facilities at Point Comfort and has not been deepened or widened since it was built in
          1962.

          There is a difference between “PORK” and an “Investment”. The channel is too shallow to be competitive thus a small “investment” would yield a great return.

  23. It is estimated that nearly 500,000,000 as of 2010 — about 1/2 billion — NEGATIVE Laws are on the books, meaning: “You, the US Citizen, cannot do 1/2 billion things, because we, the Government, have deemed such actions to be contrary to your well-being.”

    In other words: “If you don’t do what we think is for YOUR OWN GOOD, we have approved 1/2 billion ways to punish you!”

    More Laws (about 500,000,000) telling individuals what NOT to DO, than the total count of all the US Citizens alive (about 312,000,000)!

    The Arrogance of Office is best displayed by this pernicious Sophism: “Ignorance of the Law is no excuse”.

    No sane person can expect an individual to memorize all the names of the 312 million US Citizens — but same individual is expected to know the EXACTITUDE of ALL 1/2 billion LAWS (or be penalized for the IGNORANCE)?!

    Only Ron Paul has questioned this EVER increasing “Law” passing — the rest are mute (seems they lack the education to comprehend the truth the Great Roman Statesman Cicero stated: ‘The MORE Laws in a Nation, the LESS Justice for the Citizens’ — nearly 2000 years later, Cicero’s warning rings true: *More Laws = Less Liberty*)!

    No wonder the main media is doing their best to black-out Ron Paul — Truth is Bane for Big Brother wannabees.

        • Click on the avatar they gave you, then to create a profile (sign up) then they send something to your e mail. NOw I don’t remember all but you got to have the pic in your computer under just about anything (pictures, briefcase, desktop etc) something will come up saying attachments. Click search and find where your pic is on your computer. Click on it and click add. I know, clear as mud……..Hey I’m retired and I got time LOL.

    • Ugh. It’s more than a little depressing to hear it spelled out like that. Not even Stephen Hawkings can memorize and comply with that many laws. I left legal practice because I very quickly grew weary of a practice that was the equivalent of memorizing hundreds of pages of the residential phone book every day. I’ve come to the conclusion that for the really important moral issues the only laws I will memorize are the ten that God gave Moses on Mount Sinai. As far as the rest of life, I choose to use common sense and pure intentions. If that eventually lands me in jail because I run afoul of some retarded malum prohibitum, I’ll consider myself suffering persecution for the sake of liberty.

      • How to Chop Down the Tree of Liberty and Succeed: A Politician’s Handbook (one branch at a time, for as long as it takes).

        At the beginning, the Citizens had the Freedom to walk all paths. Then Government decided that some paths are not good for the people, so closed off a few paths. Now, the People had the Freedom
        to walk a few less paths. Encouraged by this, the Government passed even more laws telling the People what other things they cannot do (because it is for their own good). Pleased with the outcome — the Citizens’ obedience — the Government went into the full-time business of Manufacturing Laws (rules, regulations).

        Since Politicians produce nothing of intrinsic value — they found their calling in writing stuff on paper, telling people
        what no to do (for their own good, of-course).

        As of 2010, it is estimated that there are about 1/2 Billion Negative Laws/rules/regulations on the Books telling the People what they CANNOT DO upon threat of punishment (that’s more Laws than there are US Citizens)!
        Headlines at end of 2011 read: 40,000 New Laws in effect for 2012. Translation — 40,000 more paths each Citizen has lost the
        Liberty to walk. See how nicely this is working out below:

        11111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111
        11111111111111111111111111111111111111111111
        1111111111111111111111111111111111111111
        111111111111111111111111111111111111
        11111111111111111111111111111111
        1111111111111111111111111
        111111111111111
        1111111
        111
        1
        1
        1
        1

        Are the Citizens this blind, not to see the end result — the eventual straight-and-narrow path Government wants its Subjects to walk….

        • The citizens are the problem, not the solution. Just go to any local town hall meeting that a local politician hosts and it will be filled with citizens who want “a law passed that will prohibit…..”

          The older they are the more they want more laws passed.

          • It’s worse than that.

            Here’s a trick to “town hall meetings.” They are NOT so that the politician can “hear the people.” The purpose of “town hall meetings” is to let people blow off steam–so they won’t actually DO anything.

            Before the Iraq war, public opinion was overwhelmingly against war. So the politicians had “town hall meetings” around the country to “discuss” it. Here, we had a crowded gym, and our sleazy rep, Fred Upton, sat and one after another, we went to the mike and told him we did NOT want that war. And then, after we had blown off all that steam, telling him he was WRONG, some of us even showed appreciation for the opportunity.

            The result? Upton ignored us, voted to support the war (not enough guts to DECLARE war).

            • Had a home in Kalamazoo but the taxes drove me out. Guess that’s what drove most of the companies out too. Michigan had it all at one time but its best days are long since behind it. Well you are still number one in a lot of things like the cost of auto insurance. Last time I checked you were 2 times the price of the number 2 state.

          • FOX aired this show: “Illegal Everything” — well worth watching!

            Shows how Americans are “breaking” the law daily, without knowing it, because of the hundreds of millions of rules and regulations. And how cops are using this as an excuse to arrest anybody for just about anything!

            View it at the link below:

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?&v=CFfVeXhtRa0

      • Yippee K —

        FOX aired this show: “Illegal Everything” — well worth watching!

        Shows how Americans are “breaking” the law daily, without knowing it, because of the hundreds of millions of rules and regulations. And how cops are using this as an excuse to arrest anybody for just about anything!

        View it at the link below:

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?&v=CFfVeXhtRa0

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